Subject: RE: Operator participation

From: <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2003 15:01:02 +0100

Eric,

You may be right.  I wasn't thinking of any "set" of operators, though; just of my own requirements.  I'm not qualified to say what other operators want. 

	Regards,

	Graham Travers

	International Standards Manager
	BT Exact

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-----Original Message-----
From: Eric Rosen [mailto:[email-masked]]
Sent: 15 October 2003 14:51
To: Travers,G,Graham,XVT TRAVERG R
Cc: [email-masked]; [email-masked];
[email-masked]
Subject: Re: Operator participation

This business about  there not being enough operator  participation is a lot
of baloney. 

The  reasons   some  operators  think  that  there   isn't  enough  operator
participation are (a) different sets of operators inhabit different WGs, and
(b) operators tend  to ignore the input of other  operators who may disagree
with them.  

If you look, e.g., at the main IETF list, at the routing-discussion list, at
the idr list,  etc., you'll see one  class of operator.  If you  look at the
PWE3 list,  the MPLS list, the CCAMP  list, the L3VPN list,  the L2VPN list,
etc., you'll see an entirely  different class.  And within the latter lists,
there are  large disagreements about very fundamental  principles.  For some
reason, each group denies the existence of the others.

Of course, when  any particular operator fails to  achieve consensus for his
preferred  solution,  the  problem  is  perceived as  "not  enough  operator
input".  

I think the set  of operators that Harald is thinking of  would be aghast at
the proposals of the set of operators that Graham is thinking of.